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From Alan James – 1 May 2020
Maase is in Cregeen’s Fockleyr ny Gaelgey (1835), ‘cattle, kine’. Also, with the same meanings in Phil Kelly’s 1993 update of D.C. Fargher’s Fockleyr Gaelg-Baarle.
Balley Vaish in German is listed in Phil Kelly’s Enmyn Ynnyd, presumably that’s GB’s Ballavaish. Nothing closer to Ballavaase, though there’s Cronk y Vaase ‘hill of the cattle’ in Patrick. Kelly also
has Maase as ‘great ridge’ as in German, Maase Beg ‘little ridge’ in Andreas and Bride, and Poyll Vaaish as ‘pool of death’ in Arobory.
I’ll think further about Tannymaas.
Alan
From Michael Ansell – 1 May 2020
Good afternoon Alan, a further thought on this place-name prompted by Borgue’s proximity to the Isle of Man. In Manx Gaelic there is (or was) apparently a word maase which means ‘cattle’ and which is incorporated in the place-name Ballavaase ‘Cattle Farm’ apparently where cattle for Peel Castle garrison were kept before slaughter. Moore mentions this on p192 of The Surnames and Place-Names of the Isle of Man. However Broderick does not seem to mention this farm but has Ballavaish which might be the same place (my Manx geography knowledge is shaky!) and he says this derives from Balley y vaaish ‘farm of/on the precipice, steep sided hill’ cf Ir baitheas/baithis ‘crown of the head, pate’. He also says màs, buttock is possible however. He does not mention the supposed Manx Gaelic word maase, cattle, anywhere in his volumes.
Kind Regards
Michael
From Micheal Ansell – 22 July 2020
Yes if that was what was meant and field just left out then I agree it would be Oor Wullie’s field.
Cheers
M
From Alan James – 22 July 2020
I think we can understand ‘Field’ as generally part of the names on Rachel’s lists even if she (and presumably her informants) didn’t actually include the word.
And I’ve a hunch I have seen parallels for *’The Willie Houston Field’, though I agree if it was one that he sub-tenanted or whatever, ‘Willie Houston’s’ would be more likely.
At least it is evidence of a William Houston living in the parish during the time when that fields was probably enclosed in its surviving form.
From Michael Ansell – 22 July 2020
Interesting but is it likely that a field would be called after a person in that fashion? Seems odd to me. I can imagine Willie Houston’s field or some such but not The Willie Houston. Maybe that does happen……
KR
Michael
From Alan James – 2 July 2020
Thanks David, that’s a very nice sketch-map isn’t it? Pretty surely based on observation from a vessel sailing up through the Bay, not getting a clear view of the east side of St Mary’s Isle.
What you say about the relative sea-level is pretty consistent with Peter Friend’s account in his Collins New Naturalist ‘Scotland’ 2012, 59 – 62 and 87 – 91. As his figs. 43 and 56 show, in the past 3500 yrs or so, there’s been a fairly steady drop of at least 0.5mm p/a, which over the centuries would have made enough difference for spring tides to encroach on, and storm surges to flood, over several locations that are now dry land. As well the slow retreat of the sea, the formation of dunes and shingle bars whould have modified the geography – that may apply to the St Mary’s Isle isthmus, maybe even to the lowest part of St Cuthbert St. And I’m sure Senwick was, when the Scandinavians named it, at the head of a sandy creek, sand vík, a good half-mile inland from the present head of Brighouse Bay. It would also explain the location of the Roman fortlets on the Fleet and the Bladnoch, at crossing-points above where the tide normally reached 2000 years ago.
All the best
Alan
From David Devereux – 2 July 2020
Morning Alan
I’ve just found Gilbert’s piece on Desnes and will look forward to reading that further. My impression of the medieval geography of Kirkcudbright and St Mary’s Isle (Trail) is broadly the same as yours. Based on recent research in Wigtown Bay near Creetown, our local sea level was at least 1m higher 2000 years ago, so that at a very high tide St Mary’s Isle may well have been an island, and Sandside and the area just north and west of Park House inundated. In the town itself there was a tidal creek which ran probably from behind the museum through the parish church grounds / Soaperie Gardens and then through the present Harbour Square. Overall I have the impression of a long promontory from the site of the present town to the tip of St Mary’s Isle, and the attached English Spy’s map of the 1560s (original in the British Museum) seems to support that, although particular details may be inaccurate and drawn schematically – particularly in the layout of the town and the exaggerated northward extent of Manxman’s Lake.
best wishes
David
From Alan James – 29 June 2020
Thanks David, that’s very helpful.
I see John Gillone spelt it ‘Welltrees’, there evidently was a spring there and the name was at least interpreted as a refernce to that source. All the same, it’s a slightly odd name, a singular wælle-treow, for a prominent, landmark tree would be more typical, but of course the plural could have been added when more trees had sprung up. I think Ockham’s razor can be applied to my Brittonic suggestion.
Gillone’s map does illustrate well what a prominent location the village centre holds. I think we can be pretty conifdent that it was the power-centre dominating the lands between the lower Dee and the Fleet estuary, becoming (as I argued in my ‘Angles and Britons around Trusty’s Hill’ article) the main centre of Northumbrian control in the 7th – 9th centuries, until challenged by the Norse settlement in Borgue in the 10th. The close cluster of The Doon, a definite motte, and another fort of some kind, is very curious (though a motte next to, rather than re-using, an existing dun is paralleled close by at Boreland of Borgue).
Gilbert has lately discussed ‘Desnes’ in the Facebook Scottish P-Ns group, suggesting ‘Ness of the Dee’, which is at least a possibility. I first thought the Ross would be the best candidate for the eponymous headland from which the district(s) was/were named, but then it occurred to me that, in the 12th century, the L- shaped peninsular ridge eventually followed by Kikcudbright High Street, with Moat Brae at its tip and the castle on the angle, would have enclosed at least a tidal sea-loch (where Harbour Square, St Cuthbert St and the Soaperie Gardens are now), and might have been so-named (the name Kirkcubright, of course, would at that time have primarily referred to the old church site up above) How does that compare with your impression of the medieval geography?
All the best
Alan
From David Devereux – 29 June 2020
Morning Alan
Thank you very much for notes on the Ingleston names gathered by Rachel.
Walltrees caught my immediate attention as I have copies of early/mid 19th century documents relating to the property when the McCourtie / McCourty family were owners. Please find attached a scan of a section of John Gillone’s plan of Kirkcudbright parish (1792) prepared for the 1st Statistical Account. As you can see, fortunately for us he strayed across the border to include Twynholm and Walltrees. The map shows how Walltrees stands at the head of a burn which runs southwards, so a derivation of the p-n to include wælle or wella with the meaning ‘spring’ would seem to be appropriate geographically here. But your suggestion of a Celtic origin for the name is very interesting, and perhaps it may be historically significant that the site lies on the same watershed ridge (with the eastward flowing Kirk Burn to the north) as the church and motte.
best wishes
David
From Alan James – 4 June 2020
Oh yes! Indeed, It seems Sproats still are at LP. And ancestry sites on the net show there were folk of that name born, married and/or died at Mill of Plunton at least in the 18th – 19th cts. I had a fairly strong hunch I’d seen mention of that name in our area, though I first remember it as the name of a peculiarly obnoxious Tory MP for some part of Ayrshire in the Thatcher years.
It’s still a bit of a mystery why that rather unprepossessing corner should be called Sproat’s Field, when it seems at one time they could all have been called that.
Alan
From Michael Ansell – 4 June 2020
Good afternoon Alan and many thanks for this. My only common is that the Sproat family is quite long associated with Lennox Plunton (I think the notorious McKerlie might mention the family). I remember having a meal at Lennox Plunton with the Sproats in the 1990s.
Kind Regards
Michael
From Alan James – 21 May 2020
I agree, it’s likely to be crò-sheangan. Both words can mean ‘a narrow place’, of cró DIL says ‘A term of very wide application, the basic meaning being enclosure, enclosed space, fold, pen, etc.’; while seangán is primarily just ‘a little narrow thing’, so ‘a creature with a thin waist’. I think here it’s just ‘tight place of (the) narrows’. The entrance to the eastern arm of Kirkandrews Bay is indeed narrow, I think the name is a warning to sailors that getting into here means navigating between a rock and a hard place!
Alan
From Michael Ansell – 21 May 2020
Good afternoon John, not sure if Alan has dealt with this one but at first glance looks to me as though it might contain G crò in the sense of ‘eye of the needle’ + seangan, ostensibly ‘ant’ from such an animal’s narrow waist but which can mean thin/narrow (I think). Is there a rock formation like this in the vicinity?
If not could be crò-sheangan, ant-fold?
Kind Regards
Michael
From Alan James – 1 May 2020
Indeed, that feature at Goat Well Bay (not apparent on the 1854 6″ map) does look like another very possible fish-trap.
And evidently that’s what the surveyors were told it was – a ‘yair’ being
‘A structure erected on the bank of a river or inlet of the sea and extending out into the water,
where fish can be trapped and caught in nets; a fish-trap. ‘ DOST
https://dsl.ac.uk/entry/dost/3are_n
Thanks for the link to the TDGNHAS 1994 report, I haven’t got that volume. It evidently agrees with and confirms the reduction in relative sea-levels over the past 6000 years or so. The superficial deposits along the line of the pipeline reflect a complicated history, with deeper deposits of sand and peat going back to before the last glaciation. More recent events are well explained, the main observation that is relevant to my hypothesis into question being on pp. 20-1:
Third Period of Wind Blown Sand
The soil that formed over the Roman shell middens was covered by an episode of besanding that gave the dune system at Brighouse its present appearance. It is probably this episode of besanding that placed material in the small valley which drains into Brighouse Bay. Here the sand blanketed a peaty mire with up 0.5 metre of material. The sand also partially covered an area of peat 200 metres to the north west from which column 1 was taken.The soil horizon was covered by to 0.5 metre of sand, although locally this was over a metre in places. Above this, the modern soil horizon formed. There is no strong evidence for the date of this episode of wind blown sand. It occurred after the deposition of Roman period objects, but must have been separated from them by some period in time. A possible date for this is suggested by Luce Sands where there appears to be activity in the eighth and ninth centuries AD in dune movements.
Allowing for reasonable margins of uncertainty, that doesn’t seem to me inconsistent with my suggestion that, when Norse-speakers arrived (possiby in the 9th century, more certainly by mid-10th) they would have seen a ‘sandy creek’, extending inland where the peat and sand deposits are shown on Fig. 2 p. 14, overlooked by Senwick on the high ground to the NE. Whether this ‘creek’ was still regularly, or occasionally, flooded by the sea at that time must be uncertain, but I think it reasonable to suppose that the outlet of the valley at the head of the bay was still wide enough for their boats to have come in on the tide to be hauled onto the sand not too far below Senwick.
Alan
From David Devereux – 1 May 2020
Hello Nic
Thanks for your email.
You are quite right about the additional possible fish trap at Goatwell Bay and thanks for pointing it out; I’m looking forward to looking at it when we are allowed out again! On plan it seems to comprise a single arm or leader from the shore, the same form as may be indicated by the feature S of the quay on the 1895 OS 25″ plan of Brighouse Bay. Or maybe there’s a hint of W arm and an apex butting against the N end of that shortish rock platform shown on the map?
regards
David
